George Dyson Evening Service in D

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Patterson
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George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by Patterson » 23 May 2011 13:39

Apparently this should not have been posted, although the score is signed "Dresden,1907". A representative of Stainer & Bell has requested that it be removed.

DaveF
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by DaveF » 23 May 2011 14:08

Dyson died in 1964, so his work is still in copyright in the UK and EU. 1907 is the right date for the Service in D according to Grove, so it may be in the public domain in the USA - provided the copyright hasn't been renewed it almost certainly will be, since it was composed before 1923. It might be worth checking whether there has been a renewal - if there hasn't, then, since you're based in the US, it looks as though no copyright has been infringed and S&B are wrong. Did they actually mention anything about copyright renewal in their request to you?

DF

choralia
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by choralia » 23 May 2011 15:26

To stay on the safe side, I've (temporarily?) deleted the files and removed the links. We will possibly restore them if it is clarified that this work is PD in the USA.

Max

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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by DaveF » 23 May 2011 17:43

Probably the best idea, Max. I should have said, of course, that provided the work was published in the US before 1923 then it should be PD.

DF

Patterson
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by Patterson » 24 May 2011 12:46

Here is S&B's note to me. There is no mention of copyright renewal.
Dear Mr Patterson,

It has come to our attention that you have just posted a copy of George Dyson’s Evening Service in D on the CPDL website:

http://www1.cpdl.org/wiki/index.php/Eve ... e_Dyson%29

Please be advised that the copyright date for this work is 1924 and not 1907 as stated on the site, or 1911 as shown on your edition. This work is fully in copyright in the USA and most other countries throughout the world and we ask therefore that the files are removed from CPDL or any other websites with immediate effect.

Antony Kearns

CHGiffen
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by CHGiffen » 24 May 2011 17:11

AFAIK, the Evening Service in D was composed 1n 1907, and S&B published the work with as 1924 copyright. I'm not sure where the 1911 date comes from ... perhaps it was copyright by the composer then? - or copyright taken from some (unknown) 1911 publication and subsequently transferred (or renewed)?
Charles H. Giffen
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choralia
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by choralia » 10 Oct 2011 21:41

If this work was published in 1924, the renewal registration was due in 1952. The U.S. music renewal copyright records of 1952 have been recently published on archive.org. There is no "Evening service in D" by Dyson in the records, although there is a "Magnificat and Nunc dimittis":
dyson.gif
dyson.gif (3.16 KiB) Viewed 11942 times
If this is equivalent to the "Evening service in D", I'm afraid that this work is copyrighted in the U.S. . If it's another work, I would propose to contact Stainer & Bell to get evidence of the copyright renewal from them.

Max

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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by CHGiffen » 11 Oct 2011 02:24

Oxford Universty Press published Dyson's "Evening Service in C Minor" on 11 September 1924, which makes that copyright entry look as if it might refer to this work instead of the one in D.

OUP listing for the Evening Service in C Minor

Sample first page of Evening Service in D
Charles H. Giffen
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choralia
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by choralia » 11 Oct 2011 06:05

The only other renewal record for George Dyson in 1952 is a "Te Deum and Benedictus". I would conclude that the copyright for "Evening service in D" was probably not renewed in 1952, so this work would be public domain in the U.S. . I would suggest to contact Stainer and Bell and ask for evidence of the copyright renewal. If they cannot provide any evidence of the renewal, I think we can safely restore access to this work.

Max

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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by CHGiffen » 11 Oct 2011 22:39

Duh ... I just noticed that the copyright renewal record shown above is for a "MAGNIFICAT AND NUNC DIMITTIS; m for unison voices & piano or organ by George Dyson. © 11Sep24,..." - This MUST refer to the "Evening Service in C Minor" which is for unison voices and NOT to the "Evening Service in D" which is for SATB voices. So, now it seems that there is no evidence in the music copyright renewal records of the latter having been renewed. Stainer & Bell would have to prove otherwise.
Charles H. Giffen
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Manager of ChoralWiki
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Early Choral Music? Zephyrus (I sang 12 seasons 1992-2004 with this group).

choralia
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by choralia » 12 Oct 2011 11:11

OK, so we should definitely contact Stainer & Bell. Patterson, as you were originally contacted by a representative of S&H, you may want to reply. Otherwise I think that CPDL can contact S&B on your behalf, however we would need the precise name and email address to contact. We should exchange such information via PM so as not to publicly expose personal information of other parties.

Max

Patterson
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by Patterson » 16 Nov 2011 15:36

The complaint was originated by <removed> and CC'd to <removed>.
Last edited by choralia on 16 Nov 2011 15:53, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Removed personal information of other parties

choralia
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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by choralia » 16 Nov 2011 15:55

Thank you. I removed names and email addresses so as not to expose them publicly. I copied them to a section of these forums that is only visible to administrators and moderators. I assume you wish that CPDL contacts the publisher on your behalf.

Max

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Re: George Dyson Evening Service in D

Post by CHGiffen » 19 Nov 2011 06:47

I think I speak for the Copyright Issues group that this matter is best discussed via e-mails/PMs with the editor, so I plan to lock this topic in a day or two.
Charles H. Giffen
President of CPDL and
Manager of ChoralWiki
User pageTalk pageComposer page

Early Choral Music? Zephyrus (I sang 12 seasons 1992-2004 with this group).

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